tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post2476769012969077122..comments2024-03-28T13:10:34.074-04:00Comments on Progressive Eruptions: Wealth Inequality in America Shaw Kenawehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-91574652705364748292013-03-21T00:13:46.858-04:002013-03-21T00:13:46.858-04:00Well look who has arrived Will. Ole Whirling Dervi...Well look who has arrived Will. Ole Whirling Dervish of all people. And we thought we had lost him. But here he is ounce again, back like the plague.<br /><br />So how ya been w- dervish?Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-77990171762059211672013-03-20T11:47:26.961-04:002013-03-20T11:47:26.961-04:00Ayn Rand was a sociopathic hypocrite and her philo...Ayn Rand was a sociopathic hypocrite and her philosophy was nothing more than a transparent attempt to justify greed. RN is sorely mistaken if he thinks he can "bring around" any true progressive to this evil ideology.<br /><br />As for the "<a href="http://grammarist.com/usage/deep-seeded-deep-seated/" rel="nofollow">deep-seeded</a>" thinking a prior commenter refers to - I think this commenter has fallen prey to the libertarian deep-seated thinking that the rich reaping most of the benefit of our economic system isn't a bad thing.Dervish Sandershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13671865801885224353noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-18747206574356595172013-03-18T19:01:54.716-04:002013-03-18T19:01:54.716-04:00Shaw, you've fallen prey to the same lack of d...Shaw, you've fallen prey to the same lack of deep-seeded thinking that characterizes all progressives (and, yes, a great many conservatives also). You're looking strictly at static categories and not at the actual flesh and blood human beings who comprise them....For example, did you know that according to the IRS's own data, 58% of the people in the bottom quintile (according to income) in 1996 were out of it by 2005 and that the income of that quintile as a whole (again, the actual human beings and not the static category) went up 91%? Or that more than half of the people in the top 1% of wage earners of were no longer in that group during the same time frame and that their income actually went down? Look, I'm not necessarily indicting you for not being aware of this (hardly anybody is) but I'm also hoping that as a open-minded individual you're going to concede that this is a hell of a lot more complicated now that you do know it.............As for Mr. Ryan's budget (which I have criticized as well - mostly for his treatment of the Pentagon as a sacred cow), it raises federal spending 40% over the next 11 years and, while, yes, it does introduce a premium support option to Medicare, you should probably also know that Democrats such as John Breaux, Ron Wyden, and Alice Rivlin have themselves made some similar overtures. Yes, wealthy seniors will probably have to pay more but this whole line of the President's that ALL seniors are going to have to pay an additional $6,400 out of pocket is bullcrap and HE knows it.............Of course we could always go with Nancy Pelosi's plan for Medicare being Medicare. That'll no doubt work as well. Will "take no prisoners" Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02315659209094683602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-13227175066595344892013-03-18T17:57:35.638-04:002013-03-18T17:57:35.638-04:00Have I posted support of the Ryan recent budget pr...Have I posted support of the Ryan recent budget proposal at RN USA? I thought not. And I thank you for actually having read, at least in part, and understanding, at least in part where I am coming from. Perhaps there will come point in time when adults on both side of the debate rule the day. Unfortunately I may not live long enough to witness that day.<br /><br />Thanks again Dave...Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-59460156812980542312013-03-18T15:26:43.519-04:002013-03-18T15:26:43.519-04:00Dave,
By presenting his budget as "serious&q...Dave,<br /><br />By presenting his budget as "serious" Ryan has proved he he is anything but.<br /><br />He wants to get the country going by comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted?<br /><br /><br /><br />Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-33332103408660460342013-03-18T12:45:48.593-04:002013-03-18T12:45:48.593-04:00Now as we turn to government spending, Les please ...Now as we turn to government spending, Les please explain how it is the progressives who want capitulation from principled conservatives and libertarians when the Ryan Budget, which purports to balance the budget in 10 years, will take us back to 1948 government spending levels?<br /><br />What can we surmise from a budget that has as its baseline spending levels a year when there was no Medicare, NASA or Federal Highway System?<br /><br />http://news.investors.com/blogs-capital-hill/031313-647833-house-gop-budget-core-spending-lowest-since-1948.htm<br /><br />I give it to Ryan, at least he is honest. He truly believes gov't has no function in the daily lives of people and people that support his budget, must, by definition believe likewise.<br /><br />Shameful...<br /><br />Dave Millerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04272431500457083818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-31480856985014883222013-03-18T12:38:42.805-04:002013-03-18T12:38:42.805-04:00RN, you stated many times your view that both part...RN, you stated many times your view that both parties have blame in where we find ourselves.<br /><br />Of course that is true and Shaw has stated many times that she is not 100% happy with President Obama, even pointing out and allowing other liberal commenters to voice their displeasure.<br /><br />We are by no means a monolithic group, as you seem to imply with your comments.<br /><br />I think you'd be hard pressed to find many of the conservative blogs that we all read that were critical of President Bush while he was in office, as they were dedicated to following the company line.<br /><br />The simple fact that we in fact are openly critical of Obama argues for a different understanding.<br /><br />Now whether or not all us progressives are interested in is capitulation of the GOP, which many conservatives, principled or otherwise, and libertarians claim, there is much to be said.<br /><br />It was the progressive president who put entitlement cuts up for the "grand bargain" much to the chagrin of his more liberal base.<br /><br />It was a progressive president who has presided over one of the largest period of governmental spending cutbacks in our history.<br /><br />It is also a progressive president who does not seem much interested in cutting back the military and in fact is acting much like the prior resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.<br /><br />And what does he get?<br /><br />Les, he gets a GOP where every candidate for president said a 10 to 1 ration of cuts to revenue increases was not enough.<br /><br />He now has a "negotiating partner" who says there will be no more revenue increases, loophole closings, or new taxes of any kind.<br /><br />Here's the link in case you missed it yesterday... http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2013/03/17/a-moment-of-real-clarity-in-the-fiscal-debate/<br /><br />Who is holding who hostage?<br /><br />You in your most libertarian self, are much closer to this view of our problem than you care to admit.<br /><br />It is not President Obama, who has offered up cuts in Medicare and Social Security who is demanding capitulation, it's the GOP and the great majority of their leaders, beholden to the Rand Paul Tea Party Libertarians.<br />Dave Millerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04272431500457083818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-90294178934322729962013-03-18T10:54:28.399-04:002013-03-18T10:54:28.399-04:00Oops, I guess I gave you a bonus response.
Chow.....Oops, I guess I gave you a bonus response.<br /><br />Chow...Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-43334984818317956842013-03-18T10:53:16.647-04:002013-03-18T10:53:16.647-04:00My statements are clear if one takes the time to a...My statements are clear if one takes the time to actually think about them withoit filters or being worried about how they don't fit the progressive template.<br /><br />Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-65943051777828622452013-03-18T08:29:34.913-04:002013-03-18T08:29:34.913-04:00I don't expect an honest response from you, bu...I don't expect an honest response from you, but will point out when you are being dishonest compared to what you have written on your blog, or other people's blogs, and when the facts contradict what you say, which is most of the time. You never defend what you say, just insult the person repeating your own words. So explain with facts why you keep insisting that both parties are equally to blame for our 17 trillion dollar debt, or why we should abandon our people by killing off government and the programs that have served 100's of millions of Americans well for 100 years. "Stuff it" how original and a typical response from you. You are afraid to make clear and simple statements on what you believe, which is why (as you claim) most don't have a clue what you are talking about. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-83598250712434319062013-03-17T23:25:25.874-04:002013-03-17T23:25:25.874-04:00aNon, I'll tell you myself this time, Stuff I...aNon, I'll tell you myself this time, Stuff It. And, since you are an unworthy opponent I've given my final response to you.<br /><br />Toodles Chuckles...Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-82564305381531986092013-03-17T23:20:58.712-04:002013-03-17T23:20:58.712-04:00Shaw, I believe you might be starting to grasp jus...Shaw, I believe you might be starting to grasp just a bit of what our, and the nation's conundrum is.<br /><br />Good evening my friend, you, unlike aNom are a worthy debater. I may differ 55% of the time with your views, but who knows, maybe in time I will bring you around. ;-)Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-2057474211622982172013-03-17T21:17:21.952-04:002013-03-17T21:17:21.952-04:00So from what you've written, RN, I have to bel...So from what you've written, RN, I have to believe that YOUR perception of my position on issues is also YOUR reality, but not necessarily the what is mine.<br /><br />That cuts both ways, my friend.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-38922569761950259712013-03-17T20:59:42.430-04:002013-03-17T20:59:42.430-04:00Oh, another thing. You obviously have not grasped ...Oh, another thing. You obviously have not grasped my position on the MIC, or the DoD budget. Again Shaw you, like your progressive brethren are so busy deciding just how to fit those who don't agree 100% with your agenda into your template you completely miss the point, and opportunity.<br /><br />What the hell, such is the life...Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-55788622930461956222013-03-17T20:51:53.626-04:002013-03-17T20:51:53.626-04:00Oh, I almost forgot, I admire much of Rand's p...Oh, I almost forgot, I admire much of Rand's philosophy and freely CHOOSE as an independent individual to live by the principles of Objectivism as best as I can. As I understand the concept of rational self interest I am far more capable of rational compromise than either the hide bound progressive or statist conservative.<br /><br />Happy St. Paddy's day!Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-87019274717918886382013-03-17T20:43:58.013-04:002013-03-17T20:43:58.013-04:00"Continue with the progressive brethren to de..."Continue with the progressive brethren to demean and chastise the intelligent, hard working, reasonable, and rational conservatives and libertarians and we will never subscribe to YOUR Tyranny."<br />Now there's a statement that shows respect, compromise and understanding of all viewpoints, and typical Republican dictatorial hogwash. Tell us again how reasonable you are. Sounds just like Rush. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-28974141125608786852013-03-17T20:42:42.339-04:002013-03-17T20:42:42.339-04:00Again Shaw you are incorrect in your perception of...Again Shaw you are incorrect in your perception of what I understand. Just confirms however the saying " a person's perception is their reality", of course recognizing this helps in maintaining a balanced perspective.Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-70531560665690901052013-03-17T20:15:17.822-04:002013-03-17T20:15:17.822-04:00Fabtastic post. before you know it Liber8 will be ...Fabtastic post. before you know it Liber8 will be a very real thing.Edward Otthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17408434056681586554noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-86020894114231788102013-03-17T19:59:05.737-04:002013-03-17T19:59:05.737-04:00SK: "If you believe I should be a fence-sitt...SK: "If you believe I should be a fence-sitter on my beliefs to show "balance," you will be disappointed."<br /><br />RN: "And as I said, and your response clearly confirms, compromise with progressives is impossible."<br /><br /><br />RN, that response from you shows why it is difficult to have a discussion. Standing firm on one's beliefs has nothing to do with compromising to attain legislation to achieve them.<br /><br />You show by your answer that you don't understand that.<br /><br />And I've yet to read anything by you that is negative about Ayn Rand and Objectivism. Do you not understand that your allegiance to Objectivism has NOTHING to do with you ability to compromise on achieving it?<br /><br />Apparently not.<br /><br />You seem to have a need to prove that everyone but YOU is partisan.<br /><br />Have you looked at yourself and your partisanship on libertarianism? And, BTW, I don't recall your ever, ever telling our friend Silverfiddle that he needs to be more balanced. He's as much of a devotee to his beliefs as I am to mine, but you have no tolerance for liberals and progressives who stay true to their beliefs.<br /><br />Also, exactly what about my stand on issues do you believe I should have a more "balanced" position?<br /><br />LGBT rights? Voting rights? A woman's right to choose? Background checks for gun purchases? Climate change? Those are, among others, things I won't compromise on.<br /><br />Fiscal issues are different, and I have more flexibility on what we should do to rein in spending, starting with the Defense Department.<br /><br />Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-47873529192558661402013-03-17T18:53:03.497-04:002013-03-17T18:53:03.497-04:00"If you believe I should be a fence-sitter on..."If you believe I should be a fence-sitter on my beliefs to show "balance," you will be disappointed."<br /><br />And as I said, and your response clearly confirms, compromise with progressives is impossible.<br /><br />"And for your information, I am no more of an ideologue than you are..."<br /><br />Really? And by what evidence? Perhaps when you criticize the progressives and the democratic party (did I get right to your satisfaction)as much as I do the rEpublican party I'll believe your statement.<br /><br />"Portman? He had the nerve to come out for equality in marriage? That made him toxic in the GOP."<br /><br />Change comes hard for most people Shaw, even progressives if you understand what I'm saying. Portman should be applauded and encouraged for recognizing his mistake. <br /><br />But no, I realize you progressives, with all your BS about understanding and tolerance are really only talking bullshit. There is no tolerance and understanding about human so called "failures", doing so only works for you id it fits your template.<br /><br />I have had to live in the world of business, working with and compromising with literally hundreds of people over my 40 years in business to manage effectively. That has meant I HAVE HAD TO COMPROMISE MY PREFERENCES TO ACCOMPLISH ACHIEVING THE PRIME OBJECTIVE. And yes this has meant understanding and recognizing the value and the contributions of UNIONS. As well as respecting the talent and concerns the membership has brought to the table.<br /><br />So, please forgive me when I simply can not help but laugh at the progressives ideological and academic view of reality. <br /><br />I've been in the trenches with democrats, rEpublicans, libertarians, socialists, Marxists, virulent statists, and I have learned from them all. Can you say the same? From your posts and comments it would appear your perceived superiority of pure theory and academia guides your life. In reality it really is the practical application of both that works.<br /><br />Continue with the progressive brethren to demean and chastise the intelligent, hard working, reasonable, and rational conservatives and libertarians and we will never subscribe to YOUR Tyranny.<br /><br />Have a good day, and tell your aNonymous and ignorant shadow for me to stuff it.<br /><br />Cheerio and I'll be posting soon on the hypocrisy of the progressives. <br /><br /><br />Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-88227381574618298612013-03-17T18:34:57.822-04:002013-03-17T18:34:57.822-04:00S.W. Anderson, excellent answer to skudrunner'...S.W. Anderson, excellent answer to skudrunner's regurgitated talking points. <br /><br />Let's see if skudrunner can refute any of your facts without returning to talking points. Because it is indisputable that since the onset of Reagan's trickle-down b.s. the middle class and the poor have lost and the already richest of the rich are still winning.<br />Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-75502053827098764462013-03-17T18:12:14.883-04:002013-03-17T18:12:14.883-04:00"Yes wealth distribution is unequal but how d...<i>"Yes wealth distribution is unequal but how does stealing from wealthy help the poor . . ."?</i><br /><br />The better question, in light of how things have progressed since the so-called Reagan revolution, is, how does stealing from everyone but the rich help any people but the rich?<br /><br />The past 30 years have been a learning experience for millions of Americans with no living memory of the Great Depression and what led up to it. The answer to my better question is, it doesn't.<br /><br />Taxing the rich in proportion to their benefits received and ability to make a fair-share contribution to the common good is only stealing in minds of ignorant, selfish people.<br /><br />But to answer Skudrunner's ignorant, selfish question, four years after the Great Society programs launched, the number living in poverty in America had been reduced by nearly half. Just four years! <br /><br />And yet, during that time, no wealthy American was impoverished by the burden of taxation. The rich got richer, upper middle class people moved up to the ranks of the wealthy even as poor and working-class people made it into the middle class for the first time. And in doing that, they became net contributors to the common good instead of drags on the common good.<br /><br />During those four years, roughly a million people received education and training to make them employable and to help them find and land jobs. Just four years!<br /><br />Like John F. Kennedy (Irish, don't ya know) said, "If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich."<br /><br />Kennedy was right. He knew instinctively as well as intellectually what Molly Ivins liked to say: "We all do better when we all do better."<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />S.W. Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02388361660919375835noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-90703815472869682982013-03-17T15:57:16.670-04:002013-03-17T15:57:16.670-04:00RN got confused, because even though he says he...RN got confused, because even though he says he's Libertarian, he is just a Republican, and his statements back that up. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-88366377338562618842013-03-17T15:43:26.077-04:002013-03-17T15:43:26.077-04:00BTW, Gov. Walker of Wisconsin is coming around to ...BTW, Gov. Walker of Wisconsin is coming around to acknowledging that opposition to equality of marriage is a losing position. More and more GOPers understand that.<br /><br />The problem with the GOP is that they are not leaders on these issues. They begrudgingly follow and then join their Liberal opponents. But they are not leaders.<br /><br />That's because they use religion instead of the Constitution to guide them in their positions on social issues.<br /><br /><br />Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1883838569462983439.post-28639383625272953972013-03-17T15:35:42.770-04:002013-03-17T15:35:42.770-04:00RN, my comment @11:25 does not apply to you. I th...RN, my comment @11:25 does not apply to you. I thought you would understand that I was referring to conservative/libertarian US LEGISLATORS, because it is THEY who make decisions on whether or not to support revenue increases along with cuts in spending, not you. I fully understand that you support that position, but you don't serve in the House or Senate, so you can't influence the issue.<br /><br />And for your information, I am no more of an ideologue than you are. There are plenty of posts on your blog where you slam liberals and their ideas, and I've read them. Plus you're a great admirer of conservative blogs and their posts.<br /><br />If you believe I should be a fence-sitter on my beliefs to show "balance," you will be disappointed.<br /><br />While I don't agree with everything Democratic/Liberal politicians espouse, I do find a more welcoming, compassionate, and non-crazy atmosphere in that party than I do in the GOP. <br /><br />There's a reason so few minorities find a home in the Republican Party.<br /><br />Just look at the recent CPAC convention. They did not invite GOProud, a conservative group of gays and lesbians. And they snubbed Governor Christie because he cooperated with President Obama during Hurricane Sandy. And where was one of Romney's top choices for vp, Portman? He had the nerve to come out for equality in marriage? That made him toxic in the GOP.<br /><br />Why would I or anyone find anything to admire in the present GOP?<br /><br />I agree with the Libertarians' stand on social issues, but their idea of tiny government or extremely limited government in the third most populous country on the planet is just not practical. I dislike their slavish devotion to Ayn Rand's philosophy. <br /><br /><br /><br />Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.com