Paul Revere by Cyrus Dallin, North End, Boston

~~~

~~~

It's not a problem when GOP presidents continue their vacations when Americans are killed.

It's not a problem when GOP presidents continue their vacations when Americans are killed.
Reagan continued to ride at his ranch when 62 Americans were killed by USSR. No one trashed Reagan at the time. Because IOKIYAR! (Click on image.)

Wednesday, September 30, 2009

DAVE MILLER ASKS: WHERE ARE THE MODERATE VOICES OF THE GOP?

UPDATE BELOW:  SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM CALLS OUT THE RIGHTWING CRAZIES

Dave Miller, who hosts a wonderful blog called the mission, wrote a particularly relevant comment below in the comment section on Thomas Friedman's column in today's NYTimes.

What Dave points out is applicable to what is happening today with regard to the silence on the part of cooler heads in the GOP.  Where are they?  And yes, Dave, if they do not condemn the violent rhetoric coming from the extremists in their party, we'll see more of it, and it will grow in an uncontrolled manner that will result in great damage to the country.  The fact that the Democrats engaged in this while Mr. Bush was president doesn't excuse what is happening today.  And I do not recall Democratic Congressmen/women tacitly approving threats and hate speech directed at Mr. Bush by radical Lefties.  I do recall Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi saying something to the effect that Mr. Bush was a failure and/or loser, which happened well into his second term, and after this country had suffered through the incompetent handling of the Iraq War, Hurricane Katrina, and the impending financial disaster.  I don't recall anything as virulent as what is happening now, occuring in the first 9 months of Mr. Bush's administration, nor do I recall any radio or teevee personality with millions and millions of people in their audience calling for  Mr. Bush to fail only two months into his term.

Here is Dave Miller's comment (with his permission) on what is happening:

When terrorists attacked us on 9/11 many people were rightly upset at images of people from primarily Muslim [countries] celebrating in the streets.

As time went on we heard from some political leaders that Islam is not a dangerous religion, only that it had been hijacked by extremists.

Those types of statements were frequently met with derision from the conservative and more religious voices in the United States.

They pointed that if Islam was indeed a religion of peace, we should expect to hear from those more moderate clerics within the religion itself.

When those more moderate voices did not step forward, many on the right interpreted this as proof of a lack of tolerance and moderation within Islam.

To many, this lack of public, widespread condemnation of terrorist activities in the name of Islam showed many that this religion was not a religion of peace, but of hate.

Now we have a similar situation here in the United States.

We have people, some as individuals, some as part of loosely organized groups, and others belonging to a major political party personally attacking President Obama.

Not his policies, but him personally and even the legitimacy of his presidency.

We have seen the birthers. We have seen the witch doctor photos. We have heard the words of elected representatives.

And nowhere have we seen the voices of moderation in the GOP stand up and publicly repudiate these types of statements.

Nowhere have we seen the GOP leadership take a stand against this type of behavior similar to what they expected from the moderate leaders of Islam.

I think it safe to assume, following their logic vis-à-vis Islam, that they in fact agree with people like the birthers, Rep Franks, Rep Bachmann, and the Facebook person.

Unless and until we see GOP leadership step forward and condemn these acts, and say there is no place for them in American politics, it is safe to assume that by their silence, they condone these acts.

So, Sarah Palin, Gov. Pawlenty, Mitt Romney, and all you other GOP "leaders" with Presidential ambitions and a desire to lead, the ball is now in your court.


UPDATE:

"Sen. Lindsey Graham, (R-S.C.) offered unusually blunt assessments of the fringe elements of his party and conservative media on Thursday, calling the popular and bombastic Fox News host Glenn Beck a "cynic" whose show was antithetical to American values.


"Only in America can you make that much money crying," Graham said of Beck. "Glenn Beck is not aligned with any party. He is aligned with cynicism and there has always been a market for cynics. But we became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers."

Appearing before a crowd of Washington's elite power players and opinion-makers, Graham spoke largely without filter, offering acidic takes on subject well beyond Beck. The Senator called the birther community that questions the president's U.S. citizenship "crazy" and implored them to "knock this crap off" so the country could get on to more important matters.


"I'm here to tell you that those who think the president was not born in Hawaii are crazy," said Graham, who went on to dispel another myth: that Obama is a closet Muslim."

Read more

77 comments:

Arthurstone said...

There aren't any remaining.

Here in I recall Washington State a long tradition of progressive Republicans. In fact I found some of them far more palatable than Henry 'Scoop' Jackson, Senator from Boeing who couldn't resist putting American troops wherever 'Democracy' needed assistance.

Moderate Republicans is gone and the GOP has been taken over by the Creationist, 'Pro-Life' 'keep America strong' crowd.

Pity.

TRUTH 101 said...

Som many people cast their votes "against" because of a single issue. Millions of people even today will vote for a nut like Michelle Bachman simply because she says she is pro life or hates commies.

The right has exploited this and we have legislatures full of simple minded fools that think talk of assassination and accusing others of being socialists is intelligent and all American. They even have their own major news network to spread their words.


What have we become that this could happen here?

dmarks said...

Well, in any case, Arthur, it is certainly better to keep the nation strong (as opposed to weak) and to assist and foster democracy.

Anyway, what has McCain been saying about the worst aspects of the protests? Anything? Many considering him to be a "moderated Republican".

Dave Miller said...

Nice try dmarks. You might recall that many republicans hate[d] McCain and that whenever he tried to reach out to moderates, was branded a RINO.

Do you have anyone else?

Just like the clerics, for fear of retribution, the "moderates" in the party have been silent.

A reasonable person might think that many in the GOP might be willing to stand up be counted in opposition to what we are seeing today.

James' Muse said...

There are actually a few, at least bloggers. Those that do speak out are ostricized, in terms of GOP elected officials. But here are bloggers that are more moderate and have condemned the ridiculous of the right:

There is(my blog, and I consider myself a Progressive Republican, but I have definitely been told to leave the party on a few occasions.

There is David Frum and his New Majority, which at times agrees with the right, and on many other occasions lets the Rushites, Bushites, and Beckaroos know they are hurting the party.

There is Right Wing Nut House , a conservative who routinely mocks his own side for being stupid,

and

Republicans United, formerly The Progressive Republican which also is conservative, but points out that the GOP used to be Progressive, as in the case of Lincoln and his abolitions, Reagan and his revolution (which shook up the party of his day) and has a good series called "real republicans", and has an article up currently entitled "If Rush Limbaugh Speaks, Does Everyone Have to Listen? "

There are more. But we are called RINOS and told to leave. But us RINOS are starting to build steam, and are beginning to like the title.

Life's Just A Bowl Of Cherries said...

James' Muse said...

There are actually a few, at least bloggers. Those that do speak out are ostricized, in terms of GOP elected officials. But here are bloggers that are more moderate and have condemned the ridiculous of the right:

There is(my blog, and I consider myself a Progressive Republican



"a Progressive Republican"

Give me a break!
what the hell is "a Progressive Republican"
Your a CLOSET LIBERAL!

dmarks said...

Dave: Nice try at what? What are you accusing me of?

Anyway, your description seems to support the idea that McCain is a moderate.

Steven said: " the fact that the color of [Obama's] skin and not the content of his character was what provided him the office"

I find this assertion to be quite proposterous, and not factual. Do you have anything to support this?

I tend to think that the very small number of "vote for him because he is black" voters were cancelled out by the "vote against him because he is black" voters.

Michael said...

I'd say a Progressive Republican is someone who believes that truth should win out over ideology. Someone who believes that one of the purposes of a nation is to ensure domestic tranquility. Someone who believes a good idea is a good idea, no matter who suggests it. Someone who believes that, if taxes are to be cut, spending should be cut to a commensurate degree, and vice versa.

In short, someone who believes that the greater good of the nation is more important than courting votes from knuckledraggers.

Michael said...

And, don't forget, we had a columnist on newsmax.com advocating a military coup.

A MILITARY COUP IN THE UNITED STATES.

http://bit.ly/4G9Iye

Shaw Kenawe said...

"You know what the real shame is? Somewhere out there there’s a Black Ronald Reagan who could have really made a difference , and the shameful thing is that he will never ger his chance because Barack Obama ruined it for him."--Steven

Really? Really. A "Black" Ronald Reagan? A Black Ronald Reagan who would say that the Civil Rights act was an insult to the South? A Black Ronald Reagan who would call Dr.ML King a "near Communist?" A "Black" Ronald Reagan who would open his presidential candidacy in Philadelphia, Mississippi, where 3 civil rights workers were murdered?

I. Don't. Think. So.

Ronald Reagan knew which side his Southern Republican Bread was buttered on: racism.

Arthurstone said...

I agree dmarks.

That's why it's a pity we've aligned ourselves far too often with dictators (non-communist of course) who tyrannize and murder their own people.

James' Muse said...

Give me a break!
what the hell is "a Progressive Republican"
Your a CLOSET LIBERAL!


My point exactly. Anytime the voice of reason from the GOP speaks up, the ignorant scream insults. It just shows that posters like that can't think for themselves, and can't do anything but resort to insults.

Shaw Kenawe said...

FROM CROOKS AND LIARS: "Wednesday morning that the link to the original Newsmax article [WRITTEN BY PERRY ABOUT A MILITARY COUP] went to the main page instead of the article and sure enough, it appears Newsmax scrubbed the article.

Did the powers that be at Newsmax realize that maybe, just maybe, they had finally crossed the line? I'm curious to know why such staunch defenders of the constitution decided to cut and run on this one. They can't put the genie back in the bottle. They published an article suggesting a military coup was a real possibility and now they've scrubbed it. Do they agree with Perry, or not? They need to explain publicly why the article was pulled."

I'm guessing the sniveling cowards won't.

Dave Miller said...

Dmarks, I accused you of nothing.

I merely pointed out, correctly I might add, that when someone in the GOP does try and publicly stand up, as McCain did, he is vilified by the partisans.

All you have to do is take a look at blogs like Mikes America or Conservatism with Heart to get a real understanding of the depth of disgust for McCain, or any other closet moderates within the GOP.

Hey Steven, I'd love to have a beer with President Obama and talk about some mutual friends we have.

As I would have with Bush.

As Arthur would say...

Cheers!

TAO said...

When I started blogging I actually was a conservative, and would still be one but now after a year of reading what is labelled 'conservative' on the internet...well, I ran as fast as I could to get as far away from that bunch as my old tired legs could take me...

Since I live in a very Republican part of a very Republican state I can also attest to the fact that I am not running away alone.

Not much in the way of tea baggers, birthers, or such around here....of course the census worker who was killed is only about a 2 hour drive away...

dmarks said...

Dave: Right. I never bought into the line that McCain lost because he was not a "real Republican" and was not conservative enough. That's on Hannity and Limbaugh a lot.

Beth said...
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Beth said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Helen of Troy New York said...

The commenter "Jim" forgets that those who advocated violence and extreme hate speech against Mr. Lincoln were the traitors who seceded from the Union, and who eventually were responsible for his death.

Yeah, we've had this sort of insurgent rhetoric all through American history, and a lot of people have died as a result of it.

When will America grow up?

Jennifer said...

Good question Dave, and I think the answer is that we have become so divided that everything revolves around the two political parties. I think they believe what they are "supposed" to and if it differs from that, all hell breaks loose. All the sudden they become shunned by supporters. Instead of just being who they are, they decide what they feel based on who they are supposedly representing.

I don't think this is something new. It's been going on for both sides of the aisle because they are afraid to break free from what is expected from them. That is the problem with lifetime politicians. They cater to whoever (special interests) will get them the farthest and they are terrified of breaking those chains.

I found it refreshing that some of the democrats are standing strong in the health care debate, but that is probably because they are worried about 2010. I think limiting their terms would stop a lot of that.

Shaw Kenawe said...

Beth continues to come here and hijack my blog with her rants against Mr. Obama and her toxic anti-abortion screeds. I've asked her politely not to do so, since she has her very own blog where she can declaim to her heart's content on her favorite themes.

She has ignored me. BTW, here is a shot of the notice that comes up when I hit her name link in the comments:

This blog is open to invited readers only
http://beth113113113.blogspot.com/

If you are a reader of this blog, tell us who you are! Sign in using your Google Account.


As you can see, "Beth" feels free to come to my blog and play out her tantrums, but allows only those who she invites to comment on hers.

Good-bye Beth. Forever. You've been banished.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Shaw Kenawe said...

"And Pelosi calls us “Hate Speech” This lying Godless Democrat with NO soul…No Conscious…no truth in his whole body…is allowed to show HATE Signs…say Hate Speech full of LIES on the floor of Pelosi’ Congress…buy Joe Wilson who correctly called Obama a Liar is raked over the coals?"

Dear Anonymous,

You seem not to understand the difference between what Wilson did and what Grayson, AND MANY, MANY Republican Congressmen/women do when they speak in the House chamber about a piece of legislation.

I'm too busy just now to find it, but Rachel Maddow last night showed ON VIDEO how Republicans have been saying health care reform as proposed by the president will kill Americans. Several of them did EXACTLY what Grayson did.

Where was your hypocritical outrage then?


Joe Wilson was in attendance in the House while the POTUS gave a speech--it was not an occasion where Congressmen and women discussed a piece of legislation. The Republicans' own rules of decorum and protocol--WRITTEN BY THEM--condemn and prohibit the sort of outburst perpetrated by Wilson.

Please don't come here to write things about which you know nothing.

Shaw Kenawe said...

Anonymous,

I did your work for you. Here are examples of GOP Reps saying exactly the same sort of thing Grayson said, and none of them has apologized:

Despite Outrage, Many House Republicans Have Said Dem Health Care Will Kill People

[C]harges that the opposition's health care plan will kill people have been about as common on the House floor lately as resolutions naming post offices.

Take Rep. Ginny Brown-Waite (R-Fla.), who said in July: "Last week, Democrats released a health care bill which essentially said to America's seniors: drop dead."

Or Rep. Paul Broun (R-Ga.), a doctor, who reviewed the public health insurance option in July and diagnosed that it is "gonna kill people."

Rep. Virginia Foxx (R-N.C.), not one to pull punches, suggested on the House floor that Congress "make sure we bring down the cost of health care for all Americans and that ensures affordable access for all Americans and is pro-life because it will not put seniors in a position of being put to death by their government."

July was a busy time for House floor death sentences. Also that month, Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-Texas), noted: "One in five people have to die because they went to socialized medicine...I would hate to think that among five women, one of 'em is gonna die because we go to socialized care."

Rep. Steve King (R-Iowa) had a similar assessment. "They're going to save money by rationing care, getting you in a long line. Places like Canada, United Kingdom, and Europe. People die when they're in line," he said on the House floor in July.

Steven said...

Shaw Kenawe what you said to Anonymous is your interpretation of the facts. Not the facts. Your Links are the same.

The fact remains that precedence was set by the Democrats during the George Bush State of the Union speech when they ALL stood up and applauded their own obstruction of Social Security. While I disagree with the way Joe Wilson handled himself, I adamantly agree with his sentiment. I have to give him some kudos for actually feeling so strongly about the healthcare issue. He was certainly more passionate about his ideas on the issue than our dear President is. But, regardless of who that President is -- is not acceptable.
As for the speech, I did not watch it, because I knew in advance that I wouldn't believe anything that Obama would say. . I bet millions of Americans shouted "LIAR" from their living rooms more than once. And where is he now? In Denmark pitching for the Olympics with his wifey and Oprah? Why isn’t he in Washington instead doing his job and telling General McChrystal that he will send the troops he asked for to help the troops that are already there. please at least acknowledge the commander on the ground, if no more than to tell him you're still trying to decide!! A little communication will be respected by all. But no, As expected, Hussein retreats to attend something far more important than deal with the field General's plea who is presently fighting a war like going to Denmark with 2 airplanes full of his friends.
As the nation continues in economic crisis and Iran flips the finger at us, of course the POTUS should join the wifey in Denmark to pitch the Olympics./s Guess he either doesn't trust that Michelle can bring home the bacon on this one or he just enjoys spending tax-payer money to fly out of the country and let his Vice Clown, Biden handle the economy, healthcare reform and Iran. More poor judgment on the Prez' part. Hopefully, Denmark and friends haven't seen the video of the kid beaten to death in Chicago.
I guess there must be a sale on shoes in Denmark and first lady Michelle and Oprah want to support the sale and add a few million dollars to Denmark’s economy. .
Obama will just ignore the military request and say I didn't know anything about it. Like he said about not knowing the amount of money that was given to ACORN. And how about dealing with the Iran problem? Is Denmark also more important than that? As the Commander in Chief, Obama will make his decision and the General will say "Yes Sir". That's our Constitution, and that's the way it is.. Like it or not, it don’t make any difference how our troops are getting slaughter out there in Afghanistan. If President Obama chooses not to listen to his generals, then he needs to go all the way and completely pull out of Afghanistan. And not let the troops already there get slaughtered.
One has to wonder if Obama wants us to win or lose this war.

Shaw Kenawe said...

And where is he now? In Denmark pitching for the Olympics with his wifey and Oprah? Why isn’t he in Washington instead doing his job and telling General McChrystal that he will send the troops he asked for to help the troops that are already there.--Steve

If you have some REAL evidence that incontrovertibly shows that the president isn't doing his job--you are aware that Air Force ONE has some of the world's most sophisticated communication technologies, are you not? And please give us your inside information on what you know about what Mr. Obama and Gen. McCrystal have discussed, when they discussed it, and the number of times they have been in touch.

All you've written there is speculation tainted by your prejudical dislike of Mr. Obama. There is nothing factual in those statements you've made, unless somehow, the White House has given you special permission to receive live accounts of what goes on on Air Force One, and between Mr. Obama and his generals.

BTW, while you're feeling so indignant over Mr. Obama's 16 hour trip to Denmark, reserve some of your outrage for when George Bush spent 4 days in China during the Olympics while this country was having the worst financial meltdown since the depression.

I'm always amazed at how quickly and violently the Right pounces on things that they blithely overlooked in the last president. It seems these things are outrages only when a Democrat is doing them.

Your scolding remark is nothing less than oppositional carping over things that all presidents do--including Republicans.

You have no idea how Mr. Obama handles important details about the Iraq or Afghan War. None.

You apparently filter what others fantasize and then repeat.

Everything you've written is opinion.

I actually took words that are in the Congressional Record, spoken by Republican Reps. and in which they proclaimed, that Mr. Obama's health care reform would kill or bring death to Americans.

Those quotes are not OPINION.

Where, pray tell, are your facts about what Mr. Obama has discussed with General McCrystal? Better still, explain to us how he is wasting tax payers' money on a trip to Denmark that may bring millions and millions of dollars in revenue and badly needed jobs to this country?

And please use facts, not fantasy.

StevensOpinions said...

Shaw said: "BTW, while you're feeling so indignant over Mr. Obama's 16 hour trip to Denmark, reserve some of your outrage for when George Bush spent 4 days in China during the Olympics while this country was having the worst financial meltdown since the depression."

For crying out loud Shaw, why does every time Obams SCREWS up do you have to bring Bush into it?
One more time... Bush is out of office now, it's Obami's time to pay for his screw-ups. You can't blame Bush for him. You sound like a spoiled little child!

StevensOpinions said...

Shaw sid:"You have no idea how Mr. Obama handles important details about the Iraq or Afghan War. None."


Is he doing ANYTHING? If so no one else knows it not the media and certainly not General McChrystal.
So why is it that a guy who is SO big on speeches is SO silent now?

Try to put your SPIN on that!

Z-man said...

You see the thing with Beck and I'm by no means a hook-line-and sinker guy but he does use actual quotes of people in making his case. A few days ago he played an interview in which Obama had said the Constitution doesn't address the issue of income redistribution and Beck of course said that's a pretty Marxist thing to say so I think with Beck the ballgame is different. Don't just refute Beck but refute the quote. Instead of Obama constantly calling everything lies he could say instead "look that was very poorly worded on my part, why give the other side ammo?"

Shaw Kenawe said...

StevensOpinions said...

Shaw said: "BTW, while you're feeling so indignant over Mr. Obama's 16 hour trip to Denmark, reserve some of your outrage for when George Bush spent 4 days in China during the Olympics while this country was having the worst financial meltdown since the depression."

For crying out loud Shaw, why does every time Obams SCREWS up do you have to bring Bush into it?
One more time... Bush is out of office now, it's Obami's time to pay for his screw-ups. You can't blame Bush for him. You sound like a spoiled little child!


Steve, you apparently did not understand what I wrote. I did not blame Mr. Bush for anything. That is YOUR interpretation. Here's what I wrote:

"BTW, while you're feeling so indignant over Mr. Obama's 16 hour trip to Denmark, reserve some of your outrage for when George Bush spent 4 days in China during the Olympics while this country was having the worst financial meltdown since the depression."--Shaw

You failed to address that question, and instead misread it as "blaming" Bush. You apparently can't give me a reason why you're criticizing one president (Obama) for doing something another president did (Bush). Actually, Obama is trying to bring $$$$ to this country by advocating for having the Olympics here, unlike Bush, who was just a spectator during a very bad financial crisis.

Agains. Please explain to me and others who read here why this is a problem for you. That is my question. It is you, not I, who is being evasive. Calling me names doesn't cut it, either. People who do that usually do it because they can't answer the question.

October 1, 2009 11:20 AM
Delete
Blogger StevensOpinions said...

Shaw sid:"You have no idea how Mr. Obama handles important details about the Iraq or Afghan War. None."


Is he doing ANYTHING? If so no one else knows it not the media and certainly not General McChrystal.
So why is it that a guy who is SO big on speeches is SO silent now?

Try to put your SPIN on that!


So just because Mr. Obama hasn't rushed into a decision on a very, very difficult subject--THE AFGHAN WAR, and because Mr. Obama hasn't shared all the private conversations and meetings he's had with Gen. McCrystal, YOU believe he's doing nothing?

Again, you offer us absolutely NO PROOF, NO EVIDENCE, NOTHING about what Gen. McCrystal and Mr. Obama have discussed or what the general knows about Mr. Obama's decisions. NOTHING.

I don't have to "spin" that fact.



And you called ME childish?

Anonymous said...

Shaw said" So just because Mr. Obama hasn't rushed into a decision on a very, very difficult subject--THE AFGHAN WAR, and because Mr. Obama hasn't shared all the private conversations and meetings he's had with Gen. McCrystal, YOU believe he's doing nothing?


You wouldn't ask that question if you watched or listened to Beck on a regular basis, he only seeks answers and truth and looks to the Constitution as his guiding force. He is not afraid to say what's on his mind. I thank God for Glenn Beck!

Dave Miller said...

Steve, pointing out that a previous admin did the same thing is not placing blame.

It is putting things in context.

Shaw placed no blame on Bush, and was not even defending the actions of Obama.

She was merely asking if you were as upset by the same behavior when it was exhibited by the GOP when they held office.

So... were you?

And when Ronald Reagan continued to call the recession of the 1980's Carter's Recession clear into 1982, were you pissed off at him for not taking responsibility and ownership of a bad economy?

Simple yes or no questions.

Just askin...

Arthurstone said...

Anonymous typed:

'He is not afraid to say what's on his mind. I thank God for Glenn Beck!'

Game.

Set.

Match.

Henry Scoop' Jackson said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Arthurstone said...

Speaking of the 'Silent Majority' & the 'moderate' (and certainly the 'fair-minded' posters hereabouts) voices of the GOP I'd certainly expect a more complete repudiation of John L. Perry's remarks.

I should think 'Real Conservatives' would be appalled.

Color me amazed.

Shaw Kenawe said...

Anonymouse said this about Glenn Beck:

"You wouldn't ask that question if you watched or listened to Beck on a regular basis, he only seeks answers and truth and looks to the Constitution as his guiding force. He is not afraid to say what's on his mind. I thank God for Glenn Beck!"

No.

Beckerhead's guiding force is the voices in his head. Here's what he just recently said:

VANCOUVER LOST $1 BILLION WHEN IT "HAD THE OLYMPICS." Glenn Beck said, "Vancouver lost, how much was it? they lost a billion dollars when they had the Olympics." [Transcript, Glenn Beck Show, 9/29/09]

REALITY: VANCOUVER'S OLYMPICS WILL NOT TAKE PLACE UNTIL 2010.


WARNING: Listening to Glenn Beck and believing his stupidity is bad for your intellectual development.

TAO said...

Looks like all the new trolls hired for this month have been out in force today....

Wonder how many of them last till the end of the month...

The turnover of reactionary right trolls is astronomical...

Anonymous said...

I’ll say up front that I’m a lefty liberal, but I truly believe that a responsible, productive voice from the right is helpful (and vice-versa when power balance is reversed). What’s happening now in the GOP is freakish and dangerous. I had a family FULL of Republicans, but many of them are leaving the party because of this radical right turn into lunacy. I’ve been stunned by the silence of moderate conservatives and this Nazi/Marxist bit (which is historically so stupid that it is case-and-point to Obama’s desire to focus on education) is truly out of line. Not only is it hyperbole designed to make people afraid, it is an affront to the millions who suffered/died under Nazism and Soviet “communism.” PLEASE, non-crazy Conservatives, get this dialog back on track!! We have huge problems facing our country, and looking to Glenn Beck or Joe the Plumber is not a good way to go. We need intelligent discussion, robust debate (productive and professional), and solutions! Where are the Chuck Hagels and the Colin Powells of the party? Why are Michelle Bachmann and Sarah Palin, abd the Glenn Becks the new face (and substandard intellect) of the GOP?
Having said that I ask the more sensible people on the right like Jennifer and a handful of others why they stick to the rightwing nut jobs? Why? If they believe in the leaders of the right then they are not as sensible as I thought they were.
Seriously? You are blaming the left for how the right is acting? That is ridiculous. Maybe the left originally learned how they were “supposed” to behave from the right? Makes as much sense as your statement.

I just love how you absolve the right of any responsibility for their current actions.

StevensOpinions said...

It is amazing to read the posts and comments on this site. Most of those that do write here are flat out clairvoyant. They KNOW what lurks in the minds of men. They especially know the most daring, most controversial, and most intimate thoughts and plans of OUR LEADER. They say so! Obama is not a….

They know for a certainty that any President of the United States is not, and cannot be a humanist, a socialist, a communist, or any other ist on the list, except leftist. Can’t even have shades of thought in any of those dirty directions, or they would be detected!

Maybe if you reread your founding father documents again, you will realize that you are deep down a *classic* liberal and not a modern ‘liberal’ (aka socialist).
And yet, we are daily appalled by the moves of this strange man, the statements he makes, and the really implications of all that he does and says that are a total embarrassment to our nation.

TAO said...

Steven writes:

"And yet, we are daily appalled by the moves of this strange man, the statements he makes, and the really implications of all that he does and says that are a total embarrassment to our nation."

Who is this 'we' that are appalled daily?

What minority do you speak for? It has to be a minority because the 'strange man' that you refer to enjoys the support of a majority of those polled recently.

Shaw Kenawe said...

"And yet, we are daily appalled by the moves of this strange man, the statements he makes, and the really implications of all that he does and says that are a total embarrassment to our nation."

Steven, you make that statement as though it were a majority opinion. It isn't. It's your opinion and the opinion of a lot of extreme rightwingers.

A majority of Americans like the president, they do not believe he's a Marxist, they do not believe he's ruining the country.

This is a distinct minority opinion, enflamed by nitwits like Glenn Beck.

Because you believe these wild non-mainstream ideas does not make them so.

Most fair-minded Americans do not agree with your rhetoric.

dmarks said...

Anon: " it is an affront to the millions who suffered/died under Nazism and Soviet “communism.” "

No need to put communism in quotes. The Soviet variety of communism is/was the dominant, archetypal type.

Shaw said: "Most fair-minded Americans do not agree with your rhetoric."

I disagree with most of his policies on key points. However, I do not think he is some sort of alien-on-earth enacting a secret agenda. Nothing of the sort. He's just a guy who was born in Hawaii, and is no more of a nation-destroying Muslim monster than Bill Clinton, Al Gore, or John Kerry were. That is, not at all.


Tao said: "Looks like all the new trolls hired for this month have been out in force today...."

The grey-headed brother fake Scotty troll guy was out in full force today.

Jennifer said...

"Having said that I ask the more sensible people on the right like Jennifer and a handful of others why they stick to the rightwing nut jobs? Why? If they believe in the leaders of the right then they are not as sensible as I thought they were."

Um, I'm not sure how I entered the discussion but I'll bite, I'm in a generous mood! :-)

I don't associate myself with "rightwing nutjobs." The people on my blogroll are intelligent and rational. I have time and again wrote posts regarding those on the right that have no rationality at all. As far as government goes, I don't like anybody right now. Just about everyone is corrupt and in it for what they can get and special interests. I honestly don't like anybody from the left or the right at this point. I'd give anything to find someone that was practical and used common sense. I find that there are a handful of us out here that feel stuck in the middle. Don't agree with the left but can't abide the righties anymore either.

TAO said...

dmarks,

Where is the grey headed brother?

I missed him inbetween the 15 new righties....leave it to you to spot the one wild liberal in a huge pile of reactionary righties...

dmarks said...

Tao: They appear to be one in the same.

chazqui said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
CherryTink08 said...

I just got turned on to Glenn Beckand so I sampled a little more today and he seemed like a different Beck but I'll get to that in a sec. So they made fun of him on SNL, that show is so lame and so well past its prime that unless Tina Fey was involved it doesn't even merit a blip. OK so today Beck was talking about the federal government may force your kids to get the new Swine Flu vaccine and he was talking about all those mothers who say HELL NO!! So Beck and his sidekick were hashing this out, this massive distrust of the government thing. Beck said it's not healthy and he divided the mistrustful into two main groups: those who think the government is incompetent and those who think the government is up to something nefarious.

FOLKS, Beck ain't immune to criticism either, he's human and by taking on a kind of fringe element here that even he disagrees with he looks moderate and reasonable by comparison. Point of this blog is not to say Beck is extreme himself but that's the common assumption and perception that's out there thanks in large part to the media although he does use actual quotes of people in making his case, Obama's past statements in interviews about the Constitution doesn't address income redistribution for instance, that's a pretty Marxist thing to say and no SNLer can bury it with parody. So on today's radio show if you just tuned in for the first time and had no clue as to who Glenn Beck is Right on. He's the real deal.

Shaw Kenawe said...

And where is he now? In Denmark pitching for the Olympics with his wifey and Oprah? Why isn’t he in Washington instead doing his job and telling General McChrystal that he will send the troops he asked for to help the troops that are already there. --Steven

Just reported on the morning news, Oct. 02, 2009, at 7:25 am: GENERAL MC CRYSTAL ACCOMPANIED PRESIDENT BUSH ON THE TRIP TO DENMARK.

I hope that information allays all the people on the Right who came here and trashed the president for going to Denmark and advocating for the United States to get the Olympic Games for 2016 and millions of dollars in revenue and jobs for Americans.

And at the same time, Mr. Obama was in conference with Gen. McCrystal to discuss the Afghan War.

You can all breathe a sigh of relief now.

jonolan said...

Since I am one of the few republicans that reads your blog or comments on it I will gladly take the hit for the rest of us.

There are many republicans who are not nut-jobs as Jennifer said but your fellow commenters like the media likes to make it look like we all are by blowing out of proportion every tiny little story of the nut-jobs. I am sure that there are democrat nut-jobs, we just never get to see them because the media is NO WAY bi-partisan.

President Obama beliefs/policies/"change" are pretty much a 180 from mine and it is my job as a parent to decide if I want my kid exposed to those beliefs and in what context. Currently my kid is 16 months so it isn't an issue yet but someday it will be and I will need to make the best decision for my family.

We can agree to disagree but not to slam each others beliefs.
But disagreeing with Obama doesn’t make you a racist.. It disturbs me when people pull the race card. It disturbs me even more when the foul-mouthed commenters on this blog call their ideological counterparts the disgusting names that they do.
By the way, I am in no way misguided as YOU always seem to call people that disagree with you if I do not believe what you believe. I just had/have different guidance. I hope my Republican friends can do the same.

Shaw Kenawe said...

"Point of this blog is not to say Beck is extreme himself but that's the common assumption and perception that's out there thanks in large part to the media although he does use actual quotes of people in making his case..."--CherryTink08


Beck falsely accused Van Jones of being a "convicted felon ... who spent, I think, six months in prison after the Rodney King beating." As Eva Paterson, president and founder of the Equal Justice Society, has explained, "Van [Jones] has never served time in any prison. He has never been convicted of any crime." On August 11, Beck said (transcript from the Nexis database)

Beck jumped on Breitbart story about organizers "pray[ing]" to Obama, but Breitbart later walked back that claim. As Media Matters for America noted, on September 29, Breitbart.tv -- published by Matt Drudge protégé Andrew Breitbart -- embedded a video with the headline, "Shock Discovery: Community Organizers Pray TO President-Elect Obama." During the September 29 edition of his radio program, Beck asked executive producer Steve "Stu" Burguiere to tell the show's webmaster, Chris Brady, to post the video "on the front page of GlennBeck.com" and to "make sure that it is also included in our email newsletter." At one point, Beck suggested that the video participants were "just mocking God by faking a prayer to Obama." But Breitbart.tv subsequently updated the original post about the video with an editor's note acknowledging that "there is a debate over what is actually being said" and that the crowd may, in fact, be saying "oh God" rather than "Obama." The Gamaliel Foundation subsequently stated that "at no time have we prayed to President Obama" and that in the video, the organizers "can be heard saying, 'Hear our cry oh God,' 'Deliver us oh God,' etc."
--h/t MediaMatters

Beck is a self-identified rodeo clown, and everyone knows what we do when we see a clown. LOL!

"Obama's past statements in interviews about the Constitution doesn't address income redistribution for instance, that's a pretty Marxist thing to say and no SNLer can bury it with parody."--CT08

You need to use actual quotes from Mr. Obama, not regurgitated heresay. Show us where he talked about what you just typed, and back it up, just like I did with Beck The Clown. PS. You obviously don't understand how the Federal government redistributes revenue it receives from the poorer red states to the wealthier blue states, do you?


So on today's radio show if you just tuned in for the first time and had no clue as to who Glenn Beck is Right on. He's the real deal.--CT08

Glenn Beck is a real liar and a demagogue. He called Mr. Obama a racist. But worse than all this is that he's not remotely funny--he's not even good at being a "rodeo clown." He's as funny as the proverbial turd in a punchbowl.

I wouldn't believe Beck if he told me water was wet.

Shaw Kenawe said...

But disagreeing with Obama doesn’t make you a racist.. It disturbs me when people pull the race card.--jonolan

Glenn Beck publicly announced on FOX NEWS that President Obama is a racist with a deep-seated hatred of white people. Glenn BEck said that, not a Liberal. He played the race card.



It disturbs me even more when the foul-mouthed commenters on this blog call their ideological counterparts the disgusting names that they do. --jonolan

You must have this blog confused with someone else's, since I put a stop to that, and the only ones who use disgusting names are extremist righties who come here and usually post under someone else's name. (I've caught them at that cheating game as well.)


By the way, I am in no way misguided as YOU always seem to call people that disagree with you if I do not believe what you believe.--jonolan

You sound like someone who's been here before and used other names.

Shaw Kenawe said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
jonolan said...

The people are in pain, and the mantra of "hope and change' caused people to act emotionally. Any Democrat would have won this election; it was surprising it was as close as it was.
The media is giving Obama, Reid and Pelosi a pass because they love their agenda.

"You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift. You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down. You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred. You cannot build character and courage by taking away people's initiative and independence. You cannot help people permanently by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves."
--Abraham Lincoln


SHAW Said: "You sound like someone who's been here before and used other names."

I have been here many times, but only to read, I have never posted a comment before under my name or anyone else's.

Shaw Kenawe said...

To the person who posted a comment as CherryTink08:

I visited the link attached to your name, and I also followed the link to MySpace.

The information about this person shows that she is a 22 year old mother of an 18 month old child, and lives in Alabama. There is absolutely NOTHING on either site about politics, and generally, 22 year olds don't usually have such strong opinions on these thing.

The gadget "FEEDJIT" which appears on the right-hand side of my blog tracks the foreign countries as well as the cities in the US from where people come to visit my blog.

No one from Alabama in the last 24 hours has visited this blog. But at around the time the person who used the name CherryTink08 posted, I do see from Feedjit people from Central Islip, New York and Minneapolis, Minnesota, NOT ALABAMA, were here on my blog.

I've contacted the young mother who uses the screen name CherryTink08 to verify that she posted a political comment on my blog.

I've caught more than a few Righties cheating through plagiarism, and stealing other people's identities and posting under them here.

These are usually the same sad people who come here and howl about Mr. Obama's lies.

The jokes just write themselves.

Shaw Kenawe said...

Hmmmm. jonolan, I just read my FEEDJIT gadget and saw that at the time stamp of your post visitors from Central Islip, New York, and Traverse City, Michigan were here (I know who the person from Traverse City, MI, is, because he visits me almost everyday, and there was a link to his blog, which I have posted on, attached to the date stamp on his visit.)

So it appears, from my preliminary detective work, that someone from Central Islip, New York visited my blog this morning when BOTH CherryTink08 AND jonolan posted a comment.

Coincidence? I report; you decide.

aelusiveone said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
CherryTink08: said...

wow, you really are a compulsive nut.
You really do have a problem with issues. you've got a lot of rage in you and you seem to be in a imaginary world. like everyone is out to get you. but really, you need to read you comments out loud before you hit that publish button. maybe you'll realize how nutty you sound.

Shaw Kenawe said...

To the putative CherryTink08:

It's interesting that you came here to make a non-denial denial by accusing me of being "nutty," but YOU didn't answer the comment I left on the CherryTink08's "sodahead" blog where I asked her if she really posted on my blog.

And you did not unequivocally identify yourself as that 22 year old mother of an 18-month old who lives in Alabama. And so far, NO ONE FROM ALABAMA has posted on this blog, according to my FEEDJIT gadget.

Nice try at deflection. Didn't work.

You did not give any evidence to prove you are who you purport to be. I have caught others in identity stealing, and this smelled like another such scam.

ME AND MY SELF said...

NEWS BREAK..
CHICAGO WAS ELIMINATED FROM GETTING THE OLYMPICS.
ON THE FIRST ROUND!

Shaw Kenawe said...

That's a shame. But kudos to President Obama for taking the time to promote America!

Anyone taking pride in this loss is taking pride in seeing America lose out.

Good try, Mr. Obama. We appreciate your efforts.

Shaw Kenawe said...

To the commenter who posted as CherryTink08:

You still haven't answered me on your "sodahead" social connection space where I've asked you to confirm that you wrote comments here earlier this morning. All you have to do is answer "yes, that was me." And it will prove to me you are who you say you are.

Otherwise, I'll have to assume you're another identity thief, just like the ones I exposed last month.

A lot of you Righties seem to engage in this sort of cheating on a regular basis. Can anyone explain why?

dmarks said...

Shaw: There are too many of them, but sometimes I think it is more a case of three Hydra's, rather than 21 separate serpents.

Shaw Kenawe said...

I think you're right, dmarks. I can recognize some styles of writing that have much in common with 2 or 3 of these drive-by blogging commenters.

Jennifer said...

I honestly don't understand all the secrecy about who you are. Don't get me wrong, I don't expect anyone to give their real name, but there is something to say for those that have an identity and stand by it. What makes me laugh is those that don't realize that we have the technology to track where they are coming from. To speak anonymously is cowardly and I don't give what they say a bit of regard!

TRUTH 101 said...

I was always entertained by the "anonymouses" that pretended to be a five or six anonymouses having a conversation with each other. Multiple personalities maybe? It's kind of sad when these clowns do that on their own blogs though so it appears they get traffic.

dmarks said...

Truth: Sometimes the phenomenon is called "sock puppets".

Jim said...

Back to the original question of where the Repub mods are, well, they are having brewskies with the Dem mods don't ya know. Must be a very small bar too.

Arthurstone said...

I love seeing the photo of Jim & his big rig before they head out to earn a living on one of the great Socialist experiments of the 1950's.

The Interstate Highway System.

dmarks said...

Arthur: That experiment happens to have been inspired by the highways that the Socialist government in Germany created in the 1930s and 1940s.

Arthurstone said...

A good idea is a good idea is a good idea.

And the Interstate Highway system is just one of a countless number of (mostly) good ideas from Socialism. Medicare.The National Park System. Environmental Regulations. Labor Laws. etc. etc.

The Founding Fathers couldn't think of everything.

Michael said...

http://bit.ly/10t9JI

Charlie Pierce on Republicans and race:

"The accelerant of racism was bottled up for use by the rising conservative movement--and by the Republican party, to whom it pledged itself--as far back as 1964, when the party committed itself to the support of the remnants of white-supremacy for reasons of pure political advantage. Since then, it has been poured out when and where necessary. (Although George Wallace also manufactured his own distilled brand in 1968 and in 1972, which the GOP bought out, like Pabst buying out Schlitz.) It was there when Richard Nixon talked about "law and order," when Lee Atwater dropped Willie Horton on Michael Dukakis's head, and it was there when kindly old Dutch Reagan kicked off his campaign in Philadelphia, Mississippi, talking about states rights, and when he blathered on about fictitious "welfare queens" and when his administration went to court to defend the tax-exempt status of segregated Southern academies. The difference is that conservatism was usually careful about how it calibrated the amount of accelerant to pour into the conflict. It got so good at measuring the amount that it forgot the simple fact that, sooner or later, the fire can consume the arsonist as well. Now that the national Republican party is solely the province of meathead politicians and radio maniacs, there are "sensible" conservatives who are alarmed by what they see. It should be agreed upon in our politics that these people drift into the wilderness for a while and muse upon where their movement has led them. But the first thing they all should do is apologize to the nation for choosing to take a course 45 years ago in opposition to the transcendant moral issue of America. They prospered through bigotry, and then through a deft ability to package it, and they made the ensuing four decades immeasurably crueler as a result.There's not enough sackcloth in the world for these clowns."

Shaw Kenawe said...

Thank you for that, Michael. I'll probably put that up as a post.

Conservatives will never understand how they used the "Southern Strategy" to advance their ideology, and now, the "Southern Strategy" is the province of regional politics, which the rest of the country as moved away from.

Shaw Kenawe said...

HAS moved away from.

dmarks said...

" and when he blathered on about fictitious "welfare queens"

They are quite real, and most of them then, as now, are white.

dmarks said...

All in all, the whole thing does not make much sense. The black middle class grew a lot during the administration of supposedly racist Ronald Reagan. The Willie Horton thing was not about the man's race, but about him being a "poster child" for the failure of a furlough program Michael Dukakis really dragged his feet to shut down.

The GOP has tended to stand for equal rights, while the Dems have played the "race card" by insisting on blatantly racist hiring quotas/preference/goals. If the GOP has "bought" Southern votes by opposing this institutional racism and insisting on racial equality.

If you want to see the racist current in the Left come to the forefront, just look at any state when Ward Connnerly starts an initiative to ban racist policies. The leftists end up being the ones who support racism in these fights, while the conservatives fight for racial equality.
s

(Researching into several places, it also looks hard to put a racial spin on Nixon's "law and order".)

Jim said...

Arthurstone, if only the economy today could be as it was in the 50's!

Jim said...

Hey, Charlie Pierce, your full of it!

As a service to my liberal friends, to help you in getting somewhat educated, read this.

After that exercise, make a list of the major cities in America over 250k in population and determine how long each has endured one party rule and the results of that rule. Should open your eyes.

These folks did not wait for a government handout or whine and complain about their situation in life. They took life by the horns and made it happen. Only Oprah made billions off folks staying in the house watching her sob stories.

I rambled there I know, sorry, but this race baiting by the left is very dishonest. As a conservative, I believe each of us has unique abilities to succeed. One just has to find out what that is and follow your heart. Don't depend on the government, you'll only be disappointed.